Ranked Vengeful (Developing a rating system based on per game player ranking) Discussion

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#242

one case i forgot: goon lynched d1 leads to 1 conf town in lylo, obviously the nonconfirmed town has a 100% chance of voting correctly so they’d get 0 points for the vote.

Let A = townie who was shot, B = townie who was confirmed, C = remaining townie

Assume they all voted mafia correctly d1.
Then: If town LOSES we have Mafia, A(6), C(5), B(2), if town WINS we have B(12), C(8), A(6), Mafia which isn’t ideal.

So we’ll try the small adjustment where in this case townie A gets a chance to privately submit their pick between C and the living mafia and gets +2 if correct. (So in the case of a town win in this scenario, A, B, and C all gain rating). The window for this submission is before the hammer threshold is passed in the game day.

#243

Okay so I think this is kinda hacky but ranking people “correctly” for vengeful. Working on generalizing which may lead to small adjustments/rescaling of constants. Shouldn’t effect play.

The above post-death submission thing isn’t something I want standardized, looking for better sol. Might have a min amount of town that gains + ranking and then max is decided by the change threshold from + to -.

Bottom line is if some degenerate line is discovered we’ll fix the math to patch it out.

#244

In a similar way to how we changed “lynched” to “amount of town voting you”, we’re looking at generalizing the success bonus to “amount of town also voting mafia”

#245

Switching to using TrueSkill for the ratings (so going to redo the ratings for game 1. Each player is technically assigned a duple in true skill (a mu from 0-50 that’s their level and a sigma that represents uncertainty). They recommend using mu - 3sigma for leaderboard purposes so we’ll probably do that for all public displays. This obviously means that playing more will be rewarded.

An interesting alternative was the ree algorithm by rankade but it’s not opensource so I can’t actually check what it’s doing.

#246

What

#247

:face_with_monocle:

1 Like
#248

this is actually so annoying to implement

#249
#250

Ellibeteth, do you plan to make a ranking system for Neutrals, or no?

#251

no plans at present.

#252

I thought we weren’t looking for a subjective scoring system tho

1 Like
#253

Removing portion about how 1 and 2 always have rating go up and 3 and 4 always go down since that will no longer be true in general.

#254

The final value will always be between 0 and 50. Should we put the dull decimal in the profile or round or multiple by 100 to look more “traditional”.

#255

“Traditional” probably has broadest appeal

#256

There’s also these guys which generate more traditional feeling numbers, but I just can’t…

#257

Another change:

Hammers are active after everyone has voted at least once.

4 Likes
#258

reeeeeee

#259

reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

#260

Philosophical question that’s exclusive to vengeful:

Should hitting a shot (50/50) be equally valued to voting mafia (50/50) AND getting mafia lynched.

I’m actually leaning towards yes for simplicity. Vengeful is actually pretty shitty to generalize because of the shot (general version for how this works will be posted with Marked for Death).

#261

…wat?