Deep Space 9 Mafia - Game Over!

[Andresvmb (Andrés)]

I have been re-reading from #2476. Some thoughts:

But all in all, it came out that cabd was just a plain old tracker, without knowing anything beyond that, timestamps or etc.

So, after all that confusion, I don’t think there is anything to be made out of timestamps

Given the flavor of MS’ redirect, and the flavor that seems to be associated with some of the other roles out there, I am starting to think that the Cabd role does not quite fit the overall scheme. Plain ol’ Tracker? And he’s not around to defend himself and has had to he prodded? I think we need to see all of the details of his character.

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I just want to go to night and solve this with PRs

Hints at a Night Action

I also feel like we’re giving MS too much benefit from having made this statement. It’s a soft claim, sure, but anybody could have made this statement in a game where we’ve been told that there are a lot of roles.

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I am not a big fan of Mantis’ vote in #2526. Option #3 in that rationale is not the only way in which Pyx is viable beyond both MS and Cabd being Scum. If Cabd is Scum, a RB, and lying about his track of MS, then there’s no Tracker and a Town Cop is still potentially feasible, no? Is this @Urist what you raised in #2518?

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I don’t at all mind trying to sort claims, though we know some have certainly been fake, but trying at this point to solve the balance of the game mechanics with what we have would appear to me as only encouraging the very thing everyone of us was againt from Scum!Nanook yesterday, of mass claiming.

Just to remind myself that Pyx did make this valid point and that I agree. I stated as such in #2551, but have wavered since.

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for the record, the Pah-Wraiths flavour would very strongly support a “possession” mechanic where the scum is able to perform the nightkill “through” another player. i.e. track-frame.
Like literally the entities known as Pah-Wraiths were only able to manipulate our space by possessing someone.

I will admit that the odds of this are not as low as Scum redirecting MS onto the NK and Town successfully tracking that player, since they don’t involve Scum choosing a player with limited information that has a PR. It is possible you are being forced to defend MS because you would basically be the next lynch target if MS flipped Scum, or because you are truly convinced that MS is Town. You continue to shoot down any ideas that conflict with this viewpoint (#2569 for example).

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It wasn’t a huge point. And I had thought of Strongman, but dismissed it as unlikely. Not only is strongman a garbage role, but it would require us to have, at the very least, a full doctor… something I don’t see as super likely given how many other roles there are out there.

@Urist, this has changed completely now that Srceenplay has claimed Doctor. Should we be lynching MS?

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I think it’s making cabd look worse off

You are a Doctor, and are making this statement? After there’s a conversation that MS could be a Strongman, and Urist dismissing it as unlikely? Shouldn’t you have stepped in there? Were you trying to avoid full claiming?

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Stop and say hello hay you need to say.
My vote is on ms
Unlesss was hey come clean about something spectacular

This skepticism makes sense given your role.

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but regardless if cabd is town or scum, it doesnt affect me if im town or scum either. thats the issue. its not somethign i want to deal with at the moment and honestly i suggest you guys dont either

This seems odd. Saying this about someone who is accusing you of a guilty doesn’t make sense in my head.

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VOTE: unvote

I don’t know why you changed your mind here.

VOTE: judge

Or why this makes sense.

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But instead he has put it out there that he is the doctor, and in time for there to be a Counter Claim.
Doctor is not a role that scum would often false claim.
Far to much chance that there is a genuine doctor in the game.

I can see that it would be a big risk to fake claim this, unless they can tell from their own Scum roles that it is unlikely for there to be a Town Doctor. With Srceen claiming Doctor however, I would expect him to be much more skeptical of MS. And I’m not seeing a whole bunch of it. I can’t decide if Pyx’s skepticism of the claim fits a Town mindset - Srceenplay fake claiming earlier is the sort of thing that would create doubts about any subsequent claims he makes. The opposite I suppose is true of anybody taking the claim at face value.

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i kind of doubt that it would apply to tracks as well as investigations. can you ask the mod for clarification?
UNVOTE: pyx since Srceen’s role makes miller seem more likely now.

Can you explain?

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I think we should lynch josh. He is full of it with “I have never read me wrong”. He did that in chosen mafia too @andres to try to lynch me and he turned out to be scum. Caught by the magnificent (and now dead) MUFFINA (also known as _fferyllt). It would explain why MUFFINA died last night so early.

Urist already pointed this out but Josh was defending you that game and Scum reading Alisae. That, however, fit with the fact that Josh was Scum and Alisae was Chosen (and needed to be mislynched for Scum to have better odds).

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no case. Just more of an inkling like… maybe this IS the way to go?

I don’t really trust my reads this game. so it’s ALL up in the air!

This doesn’t seem Towny. I think there’s enough content to mine to make some sort of conclusion. This definitely chips at my view of you as careful.

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andres could be scum

As does this. Really? Not even a broader case to make here? Why am I Scum? It’s a complete throwaway remark and totally unsubstantiated by anything you’ve said all game.

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Actually I also think josh and cabd

There’s something to be said about MS pushing for a Cabd lynch. If Cabd flips Town Tracker, then despite it not confirming MS as Scum, I don’t know if we don’t decide to flip you out of policy.

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It will be sad… but it won’t be that big of a deal. He really needs to get flipped, because we aren’t getting any information… or anything from him. It won’t be anyone’s fault. : )

Mantis, if you are Town, why would you say stuff like this (assuming this isn’t said in jest, which clearly I’m not good at reading)? You are giving Scum an out if we collectively decide to go for Cabd.

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I’m through #2861, and will keep reading. I’ll be out of pocket for the next 4 hours, and then I’ll be back.

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Some side thoughts:
In #2557, I made a point about leaving the Cabd slot to sort itself out. Given Srceen’s claim, maybe we don’t have to anymore.
It should go without saying that if for whatever reason we flip MS and MS flips Town, we should lynch Josh without hesitation. Nobody should be allowed to be so certain about a meta read and be wrong.

[Andresvmb (Andrés)]

I need a VC urgently.

[Andresvmb (Andrés)]

Crap this is a bad time to be getting on a plane, and I don’t feel like paying for WiFi. Can you guys just wait and not hammer?

[MetalSonic]

i’m at 4/6 votes.

josh is at 3/6.

[Srceenplay]

MS could be a Strongman

I’m not following why the thought of him being strongman comes from.

[Srceenplay]

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Srceenplay:

VOTE: unvote

I don’t know why you changed your mind here.

Srceenplay:

VOTE: judge

Or why this makes sense.

because i dont know what to think

[Josh]

I can claim if ya want, I’m not vanilla but theres no role reasons not to lynch me. Common sense reasons, sure, but that doesnt exist itg so nbd.

[Srceenplay]

I would expect him to be much more skeptical of MS.

i was waiting for him to claim the role cop role that i wanted in this gamw

[Josh]

wasnt I one of your strongest townreads?

[Mantis]

I’ve kinda given up. I mean I thought you were. But I’ve also never seen your scum game

[Josh]

why does you giving up make me your vote?

also, did you get a piece of apparel last night?

[Mantis]

Ya I got a gown. I mentioned it near the start of the day. Because I’m not really trusting a lot of my reads. At one point I was certain it was pyx - that’s changed now. Then certainty with MS - but his comment were he said he was starting to get pissed off with the game, struck me as real

[Mantis]

Is that your role? Kinda like a fruit vendor ?

[Josh]

kind of. I took a strange glowing green orb, my role pm implies I need to find something by targeting the right person to do something not specified

[Mantis]

Oh interesting… I just read the message again, and what happened was the green orb I had was gone… and replaced by a gown lol. So i guess you took it

That’s likely the one that got me into the neighborhood

[Josh]

I dont know source flavour at all so no clue what I’m meant to do

[Mantis]

I’m just looking at this atm

Orb

[Mantis]

@Josh did you give the bauble to judge/ad?

[pyx]

My role says if anyone I target is target by invest the invest will also receive info on me.
So as soon as he claimed miller I thought, this is a perfect combo.

So if a Rolecop of either alignment investigates your target they’ll get a result of your role?
And if an Alignment Cop investigates your target they’ll get your true alignment, that of your target and yourself, or will you be read as the alignment of your target? Or do you know which?

[pyx]

I’m just thinking there are a lot of Town PR claims for 2 measly scum. And as such it maybe makes the possession thing more feasible, and I’d almost expect investigative roles on both sides; OR, if it’s far simpler and direct as Josh suggests, and one of cabd or MS are being false, then too the complexity of what roles have been claimed are suspect as being not all of Town.